And Then

Thoughts Began To Fly

Clowns at play again!

Published by Aakarsh under on Sunday, November 30, 2008

On the very first day of the Terrorist attacks in Bombay, out of the shock, horror and helplessness that I am reminded of, there was only one element of solace... that our politicians maintained poise and did not indulge in the usual blame-game at each other. I thought all the Opposition parties would start blaming the Govt, instead of doing something concrete such as helping people at the hospitals or giving the moral support to India, a unified India, by using their oratory skills. But they surprised me, completely, by not speaking a word against the Government. The attitude of BJP, in particular, impressed me when they refused to use this gruesome incident as a tool to gain political advantage. "Ah! Sensibility Finally", I thought. I think the Govt. has to be blamed, but not at that hour and many parties displayed that sense of poise, much to my pleasant (the only pleasant thing on that day) surprise.

But then, within 24 hours, it is work as usual. I forgot, that they are politicians. How can they ever be stable? How can they ever stand by something? BJP chieftain Mr.Advani, as usual, boasted about how he could answer terrorists better in his heydays, ie., in his position as Home Minister during BJP rule. I saw him say "When they attacked in various places, the way we answered them was strong and unprecedented. we didn't spare them". My Dear Advaniji, What is the point you are trying to make?  You talk about bloody answering them. But Could you avoid those attacks from happening in the first place? Attacks happened right. So how does that differentiate your Govt. from this current Govt.? So, what are you beating your chest for, in this hour that too? And answering them is not your job anyways. It is not the job of this Govt. too. it is the army, the NSG, Naval commandos, the police... So, I don't see any difference, between that Govt. and this Govt. 

A newspaper in Bombay, today, had this message to the people - "Witness a terrorism free India, by voting for BJP" (translated from Hindi). The operation or rather the war with the terrorists at Taj Hotel did not finish yet. The bodies of victims have not been identified yet. The blood in the incident locations have not been cleaned yet. Do we need that message now? BJP is already up, playing to the gallery - Votes Votes and Votes. It cannot get more shameless than this. It is infact vulgar. What are the so called 'respected senior leaders' of BJP doing? I myself have had lot of respect, for some of the BJP leaders, despite differing with some of their ideologies and acts. But then, off-late, not just today, I completely lost all that. Even the so called 'statesmen' have become mere cheap politicians, who are actually running after power and not public welfare. What else can explain their statement in the newspaper at an hour when the entire World is uncertain about what could happen further and when everyone is praying for the safety of people there? Why should anyone vote for BJP? Because they Shamelessly asked, or should I say Begged, for votes in times of national despair. And can any politician, be it BJP or Congress or Janata etc, look and work beyond votes and seats of power?

Our respectable Prime Minister - addresses the nation, saying that his Govt. will take the sternest of the action in future. Really? Who are you kidding sir? You, with all those 50 doctorates you have got, might be having the noblest of the intentions. But can you really act tough, not giving in so-called suggestions of the leader of your Party. And what about your team? your ministers? your administration band? those chamchas? the entire machinery under you and under your team? Are they effective enough? Do you think atleast one sensible citizen of this country will believe you if you tell them that your men are effective enough? Don't they all together make a fantastic bunch of clowns, playing in/with/out the circus of Indian Democracy?

If only all our Police, Commandos and others dropped their hands and pushed all our Indian politicians to the war front!!! Atleast that would have been some rightful cleansing. This ethnic cleansing and all that crap which certain segments in each of our current religions (Islam, Hindus, Christianity..just everyone) are embarking on off-late, for no rational reason, will bring no good to humanity anyways. What we need, in India, is political cleansing. What would our Politicians do, if all their security personnels refuse to protect them for 5 minutes? Just 5 minutes? Given the magnitude of public anger in India, towards politicians, Can atleast one politician, without any security, dare to talk to a crowd? Can they walk into a crowd today? And a crowd which does not carry any weapon that is. A crowd in which there is not even a single terrorist or a naxalite or a militant. Can they walk into the real normal people of India? Can they dare? What will ensue is Mob violence. And I wish it ensues. I wish people of India, me included, drag these bastards out and flog them, lynch them and give them what they really deserve. and it is not just one political party. It is not about a Congress or BJP or CPI or whatever. Every insincere politician who has been doing nothing but amassing assets and properties must be dealt in the same way, even if it is undemocratic. Where is democracy anyways! And I don't think it will be undemocratic too. if atleast 51% of Indians feel the way I do, then... is it not democracy?

Watching TV since last 3 days, and following every bit of the massacre that happened in Bombay, watching those hundreds of innocent people dead, watching those brave soldiers give their lives just to end the trauma, watching those buffoons (politicians) paying their respects to far better souls (had something like that happened in my house, I would have not let a single politician bastard step into my house) than them... and anticipating the upcoming mud-slinging thats going to happen between various political parties, all I am left with is boiling blood and violent thoughts, against those terrorists who have been coming from outside... and these terrorists who have been inside, taking us all for granted - Our bloody F***ing useless politicians.

I commend, praise and appreciate the stance taken by the wife of ATS Chief Hemant Karkare, who died in this battle (There must be a good number of politicians/leaders, famous ones that too, who already criticized Karkare for his findings on Malegaon blasts and terrorism by Hindu outfits and who might now be rejoicing his death, for he came very close to wrapping up that investigation. Now they all go scot free, after paying a pseudo-homage to him)  She refused to take any compensation from Narendra Modi, who announced some compensation. Bravo! Fantastic! Kudos! for Keeping the spirit and honour of her husband alive!

 

19 comments:

Gandaragolaka said... @ Wednesday, December 03, 2008 7:55:00 PM

Aakarsh:
You are treading dangerous grounds. Take stock of where you are. By writing such posts, you are on your way to become anti-national, just like your friends NDTV, Times-Now and CNN-IBN who are already terminally ill with this disease called Anti-Nationalism. I told you many times not to trust them.

1) Someone has to politicse the issue to bring about a change in democracy. Every unfavourable incident should translate into a call for referendum on present govt. That means voting a paricular party out of power and bring another one (which people think is better suited for the job) to power. If BJP is politicising the issue, its because it has to. And thats because it was us who voted this anti-India congress to power. So it is begging us not to commit the same mistake again. Asking politicians not to politicise a major issue is a slap on the face of democracy and a sinister plot to sympathise with congress. Dont fall into that trap.

2)About Narendrabhai Modi's offer of compensation to Mr.karkare's widow: You seem to be delighted in your own perverted schadenfreud-ish way that something bad finally happened to the guy you hate so much :) (This is your cue to say: Look dude! I respect him in this way, but not that way and blah blah blah...). You should have waited till truth comes out from his own mouth before slipping into "yes! Gotcha this time!" mood and publishing it in bold.

Off Topic:
A sincere question: Why does art make a person lose her/his political wisdom and clarity? Why is it that not a single artist is amongst sensible and responsible political speakers?

Anonymous said... @ Wednesday, December 03, 2008 11:03:00 PM

Aakarsh, when there was only one way to get you view wrong, you chose it, yet again!

But why do you think I will not be surprised to find you 'lighting a candle', 'joining a march' or holding a 'Don't Vote in 2009' placard? Well that is what will follow from you when you are in this line.

May a 'secular' God save you!

Aakarsh said... @ Thursday, December 04, 2008 2:20:00 AM

Kedar,

what made you think that NDTV, Times Now and CNN are my friends, when i hated the cove'rage' of entire media? I dont understand why you often jump to conclusions about something i write.No,My opinions/posts are not a resultant of any news channel, bcoz i have given up on them ever since the who,the media thingy turned into a mad race.yes, i watched the news but i didnt get swayed by their nonsense either.not just these, add Headlines today and India TV too.so your hypothesis itself is wrong.

Secondly, about BJP politicing! well you are a BJP supporter dude. Whatever i say..you will defend or argue.No point.Anyways,my point was not about politicising...but about politicising at that hour when the battle was still On. You are missing it.People are totally fed up seeing politicians play the same game again and again you are saying that BJP needs to play that game.Fair enough probably, bccoz it is as upset as I am, as a citizen.. but not at that hour when people least want to see it.C'mon,I really believe that it is a very wrong time to beg for votes.And not just BJP, but any party. But then you will disagree,bcoz since BJP did it, you think it is right.Had it been congress(and i hate this party too), you would have said what i am saying now.

And lastly, you again misunderstand me, as usual.I was glad that she rejected the compensation and i would have been equally glad if it were Vilas Rao Deshmukh or Sharad Pawar or just anyone instead of your Modi-bhai. My anger is towards politicians and it is reflected in my next post too right, in which i expressed my anger towards Kerala CM.Defnly he is not BJP, that i targetted him alone, as you think. Do i need to prove anything more. And I dont mix my personal opinion about Modi with this incident or for that matter any other incident.if i need to appreciate him for something, i still do(his work in Gujarat needs to be commended for sure).and this is just to let you know that i am not biased, as you think I am. but your reasoning of me taking pleasure in the denial of Modi and linking it to my dislike towards him, is an insult to my intelligence.you attribute perversion to me,just bcoz it is your Modibhai when i am pretty straight in expressing anger towards politicians.now what do i call this act of yours,attaching perversion to me?ok, i got the msg. you dont want me to slam your Modi-bhai. lookslike your ego is hurt,just because i quoted your Modi bhai in wrong way there,although i didnt intend to quote him specifically.anyways,will take care, next time.

So bottomline: stop misunderstanding me.if you cant get me right, dont waste your time.


Vidyanath:
Even you too get me wrong.I am no party or game to this idiotic candle business which is useless.So be not only surprised,but shocked.sorry for disappointing you.

And as far as i know, God doesnt have a label 'secular', etc.in case you can enlighten me further on these new 'secular', 'non-secular' or 'fanatic' gods, it would probably really save me.and even if there are, i think a 'secular' god is much better than a 'BJP' God or a 'VHP' God, atleast for me.

and guys,since you both,will again, as usual and much similarly conclude i am completely an Anti-BJP 'pervert' specifically,let me reassure you that I wish BJP comes to power next time and unlike you, i am not sarcastic.Now come on,smile.your idols have 1 vote.

Gandaragolaka said... @ Thursday, December 04, 2008 8:45:00 AM

First of all, its nice to know that you are not one of those candle-lighting eminent citizenry of India.

Secondly, its also nice to know that you realise that there has to be a regime change, and the change must come from we the people.

Thirdly, watch NewsX channel. Its slightly better than others. Atleast they have cut back on the sensationalism factor. And they dont lie (as far as I have seen).
---------------------------------
If you have given up on the news channels, how can you say that they are giving you the right information? That bit about Narendrabhai Modi could easily be plain lies. I have seen news items on google that mention him going to Mr.Karkare's home without mentioning anything about compensation or its rejection whatsoever.

If you say you have given up on media, but you still watch them not for opinions, but for plain news, then you are being extremely naive. They lie blatantly. That part should have become obvious by now.
----------------------------------

"People are totally fed up seeing politicians play the same game again and again you are saying that BJP needs to play that game.Fair enough probably, bccoz it is as upset as I am, as a citizen.. but not at that hour when people least want to see it."

1)Umm... lets just speak for ourselves for now. You, or even I, are not "the people". I am again asking you to go people who vote "en masse" and talk to them. Talk to the real vote banks. Talk to the guys who make a Balakrishna or a Chiru movie hit. We are nobodies in this democracy. All this "people are fed up by politicians" talk is just a ruse by congress and its henchmen to lessen the voter turn-out so that congress has still some marginal chance of winning.

2)When, according to you, is the most opportune time "to beg for votes" then?

3)And why do you think the media and the usual "secular eminences" will not hesitate even at that "most opportune time" to say that "BJP is politicising the issue"?

Anonymous said... @ Thursday, December 04, 2008 10:33:00 AM

""This ethnic cleansing and all that crap which certain segments in each of our current religions (Islam, Hindus, Christianity..just everyone) are embarking on off-late, for no rational reason, will bring no good to humanity anyways.""

Aakarsh, this is exactly the reason why you need a secular God to help you (who is, as you defined perfectly, not a VHP-god).

Aakarsh said... @ Thursday, December 04, 2008 11:42:00 AM

Kedar,

you are again missing it.Look,i myself am blaming the govt. here.But tell me,will people really get the point if BJP or any party does the same at that hour.Couldnt they wait.Is it not like encashing on the weak moment?Why do they need a weak moment to encash on, if they are strong enough to win by their own merit?thats what i am talking.I am not questioning the merit here again.But if they had waited till this whole thing subsided,they could have better points to putforth people.Like they could have waited till these investigations going on.American Intelligence warned that Terrorists could come via sea and an attack is imminent.this piece came out 3 days after the attack,if i am not wrong.Just like how you expected me to wait for what Modi had to say regarding compensation issue (you wrote it above,plz dont refute), couldnt BJP wait.Elections still have time right.whats the hurry?why encash on a weak moment when they think they have the merit?And as i wrote, Mr.Advani told that he answered terrorists better.but why that boasting needed at that hour?Indirectly,is he not admitting that attacks did happen in his regime too?he could have waited for just few days and blasted congress in far more sensible way,dont you think?Please dont tell that just bcoz it is BJP and Advani,all they do is right.

Vidya,

You still fail to define 'secular' God and you seem to be pointing that I am wrong in having a belief in the good for humanity.Ok,i understand,there is no point. You are 100% right boss!give me the name of that 'secular' God so that i can pray and seek help.

Gandaragolaka said... @ Thursday, December 04, 2008 1:16:00 PM

"Just like how you expected me to wait for what Modi had to say regarding compensation issue (you wrote it above,plz dont refute), couldnt BJP wait.Elections still have time right.whats the hurry?"

Clever, but not the right analogy.

It simply doesnt matter what the BJP says and does at this time. We just need to make sure it does anything and everything to secure an absolute majority in the elections. The party knows the language that wins majority in Parliament.

So lets not take umbrage at BJPs comments when its not in power. Its like an uptight Englishman who gets offended when Sehwag doesnt show even a hint of footwork. It simply doesnt matter. A boundary is a boundary with or without the footwork. So dont look for the moral footwork. Look at the boundaries.

You (and mostly all of us) will get to comment on and critique BJP, and thats AFTER it comes to power. Can it fulfill the aspirations of people? Thats the real question. So lets relax on that front for now.

-------------------------------
By the way, lets cut the hypocritical non-achieving 'humanity' crap shall we?

And before you accuse my religion of ethnic cleansing one more time, go through the link below, provide enough counter arguments, and then come back to me before you dare/care to do so again:
http://www.deeshaa.org/2008/12/04/tragedy-and-farce-part-2/

Aakarsh said... @ Thursday, December 04, 2008 2:05:00 PM

looks like we again hit a dead end. I think it was a wrong time while you think it was right time for BJP to put up that act.so forget it/

1. hypocritic Humanity crap??what do you mean by this?do you mean that being sensitive to the dying of so many people, irrespective of religion,is hypocritic?Do i look like someone who wishes for some genocide?

2. i didnt accuse 'your' religion alone and in its totality sir.I accused 'segments' of 'every religion' which commits some crime against another religion,just to gain dominance.Segments of Islam does, segments of Christianity does and so on...if you are 100% sure that Hindu religion does not have any single segment which does that,then it is really music, a great music, to my ears.So,plz confirm.but let your answer be precise, instead of covering something as a result of something else and all that. Just a plain Yes or No.if it is really true that no segment of Hindu religion is associated with any crime towards other religion,I shall be indeed proud of it(and i have many other reasons too to be proud of Hinduism,before you quickly conclude,as usual,that i am not at all proud of it so far).sseriously,it really means a lot to me and the honour of Hinduism.so let me know,in a very brief Yes or No.

and kedar,i agree with the author of that post in that link.I myself have told you before,that there are 100 things about Islam ideology which i dont agree with and which i dislike.i dont know why you constantly view me as 'Islam supporter' or 'Hindu hater'(i am neither),which is probably your definition of 'secularism'. But my point has always been, "So what do we do now, with the Muslims?". I ask this question.Killing them is not a solution,which i hope even you would agree and you did before.But when i am agreeing with you about the loopholes in ideology of Islam,why are you again coming back at me?My question remains - So what do we practically do now? another partition is impractical.Killing is inhuman(i hope i am not sounding hypocritical).snubbing them is discrimination,which fosters terrorism further.Then what? Give me any reasonable answer.

Aakarsh said... @ Thursday, December 04, 2008 2:20:00 PM

The Post script, paragraph in that link you sent, sums it up.the author's thoughts form precisely my opinion and my take on the whole thing.it is a very good post infact since i felt it echoes my thoughts. my question is "what do we do,without repeating just what certain sections of Islam does?"

and i think any act of violence or terror,agaist any set of individuals has to be condemned and i do so,irrespective of religion. and for that, you folks call me 'secular' and 'hypocritic' is it? what can i say then?fine.be it so.happy!

Gandaragolaka said... @ Thursday, December 04, 2008 9:24:00 PM

"But my point has always been, "So what do we do now, with the Muslims?""

Remember what I had said in the earlier debate?

Here we go again:
Its ok that religions have differences. Buddhist and Jain texts talk openly against the Vedas. It is also possible that some Hindu kings discriminated against people of these religions and vice versa. But we dont hear that Jains or Buddhists ever killed innocent people to have their grievances heard. Or that even Hindus got violent against some Buddhist guys. Hindus, Jains, and Buddhists resolved their differences and compromised using dialogue.

This is the basis for my strategy to deal with Hindu-Muslim conflict:

1)They must get wetern education so that they adopt a path of dialogue instead of confrontation. For this, closure of madrassas is important. Its a must for Islam to adopt to the changing environment. They cant get perennially stuck in 7th century.
2)They must learn to isolate Indian Islam from perceived atrocities in other parts of the world like Palestine, Afghanistan, China, etc.
3)Modern Islam must learn that there is nothing called "Ummah" and grand dreams of Islamic Caliphate must be shunned.
4)Most importantly, Islam (in general, and clerics in particular...not the average muslim guy on the road) has to learn to respect and treat "infidels" as brothers of a different sect. In fact, I would go so far as to say that the term "kaafir" must be abolished.
5)Relatively peaceful sects like Ahmediya and Sufi must be given an impetus to develop, and the abhorrent Wahaabis (who suddenly gained prominence after 1975) must be given a choice either to convert to these peaceful sects or face deportation.

You can see that all these 5 points (as applicable) are something Hindus have already done with regards to other religions and changing circumstances. So they are not unreasonable.

But if instead, Islam adopts a hardline approach and outrightly refuses to adopt any of these five points, then what? Do you have the courage to state the obvious?
-----------------------------------
And coming to the alleged ethnic cleaning:
Well well, Indian Muslims are also of the same ethnicity, but of a different religion. So ethnic cleansing literally means that you are dumping Muslims into a different ethnicity, which automatically means they have a right of self-determination, which means they have some sort of legitimacy to wage a war on the Indian Union and achieve "independence".

So my question is, are you sure you mean "ethnic cleansing"? It is a very very huge term and it means a whole lot of catastrophic stuff.

On the other hand, if you mean the usual riots between Hindus and Muslims and the recent "Hindu-Terrorist" episode, then that is NOT ethnic cleansing by a long shot.Its not the same genre, its not even in the 100 lightyears perimeter of ethnic cleansing.

Dont go shooting such dangerous terms from your mouth mate! You never know what sort of companions you find yourself with.

Aakarsh said... @ Friday, December 05, 2008 12:39:00 AM

Kedar,

Ah! Finally. and for the 1st time probably.

I agree with those 5 points.adopting those measures can, to some extent if not all (assuming that there could be more or additional reasonable solutions too),solve the issues.But as you said, what if these measures face rejection and there is all likelihood for that.then what? coercion is no solution right, for it breeds militancy again.

And reg ethnic cleansing, i only meant the "Must wipe them/it(religion) out to solve problems" kind of thought,which u get to see in Lashkar terrorists etc.I have seen similar attitude in few Hindus too(sometimes, in few people i met) and ofcourse, i think the motive behind the Christianity conversions is the same(i think so, if it is not so, tell me what it is).basically, everyone wants their monopoly and it translates into this cleansing thingy.what i meant is this fascination for such kind of monopoly, in perverted and inhuman manifestations.thats all.

And yes, i hated the phrase "Hindu Terrorist" and for a moment i thought, how much will an ordinary muslim hate or feel bad if people use "Islamic Terrorist" or "islamic Militant".

Anyways,your comment this time does underline the fact that co-existence is must (with those measures ofcourse, in order to solve the problems) and i hope i am interpreting it right(now dont disappoint me) and if i also have been yelling the same from my rooftop all along then why do you and Vidyanath have a problem with me being 'secular' this way.because i think this comment of yours is secular too(is it not?).In what way is your secularism(only) valid while mine has been ridiculed many a time and how are they different?.what exactly is the problem with me being 'secular'?Do enlighten.

Aakarsh said... @ Friday, December 05, 2008 12:50:00 AM

adding to it:

Know what,for the measures(which could improve things)to be implemented,people need to have confidence.Do they?See,i think things like these first need to be discussed with them and that also can be done or initiated only by educated people within their own community.Me and You(if you quote your Modi bhai there,completely no chance :) pun intended) cannot win their confidence right.And this will take enormous time.
but things like these measures are the only means of solving issues.violence,even as a retaliation,will not help.dont you think.

Anonymous said... @ Friday, December 05, 2008 7:33:00 AM

"And reg ethnic cleansing, i only meant the "Must wipe them/it(religion) out to solve problems" kind of thought,which u get to see in Lashkar terrorists etc.I have seen similar attitude in few Hindus too(sometimes, in few people i met)..."

Aakarsh, (even if you were saying in jest) please urgently report to your nearest Police Station about your Hindu friends who have Lashkar-Terrorist-like attitudes. They may well be Lashkar recruits (or worse, Hindu Terrorists of RSS).

This is advised not for humanity's sake but lest they should plant a powerful bomb (ahem!) under our secular fabric and try tearing it.

After you do that, try keeping better company.

Gandaragolaka said... @ Friday, December 05, 2008 9:54:00 AM

Aakarsh, you have a really loose tongue. Man! You have so easily clubbed Lashkar and the "alleged Hindu Terrorists". You know what Aakarsh? The news channels that you hate (chho cute of you!) NDTV, CNN-IBN, and Times-Now also say egjaactlee that same thing. You have to do more to convince fellow Indians that you are not Anti-National.

1)RSS/VHP/BJ never said Indian Muslims must be driven out of India or killed. They dont have grand pipedreams about a Hindu-Caliphate and imposition of sharia. They are mostly reactive organisations aimed at organising Hindus to effectively combat this Jihadi menace. They have consistently asked for compromise and coexistence on Muslims' part.

2)Under my Narendrabhai Modi, Muslims seem to have become more secular, and hence safer than ever before. Even the hawkish eyes of a hostile media could not catch even a single incident of Hindu-Muslim violence in the last 6 years. Gujarat's economy has prospered and Muslims have done their part for it. He is a servant of the whole Gujarat, not of Hindus in Gujarat. So there is no point in dragging Modi where it is not necessary.
3)Regarding confidence and other similiarly aromatic faeces of bovine specicies (meaning: bull shit):
Here I see a religion that is uncompromising,unchanging, breeding hatred, designed for a place alien to my country,founded in a time totally incompatible with current times, and still getting all sorts of perks and enjoying a totally parallel law system, and this guy asks me that we should wipe their arse so that they can get confidence that we are here just to wipe their arse, not penetrate it!

No my dear fellow. They have to get their house in order first. They have to realise that this is not Arabia. And that this is not 7th century. The burden of effecting the change is upon them.
Its THEY who must change.

Nevertheless, this is a good assignment for you. Since you agree with the 5 points I mentioned, you just talk to the Muslims brethren you know and try to "build confidence" and convince them to implement these 5 measures atleast personally, not even with regard to their family or society.
I wish you all the success.

Aakarsh said... @ Friday, December 05, 2008 12:10:00 PM

Vidya,

you never cease to surprise me.They are not my friends.they are not even acquaintances.they are someone like your colleague's friend's friend,with whom you just get to spend 5mins,unintentionally,somewhere and you get to see their thoughts. Fortunately,i do not have such friends as company. and now you too talk about humanity.when i did,it was perceived as hypocrisy.Anyways,whatever happened to that 'secular' God you were suggesting.i am still waiting for the name.

Kedar,
Just when i think you finally get me right, you completely recoil.I myself condemned that phrase 'Hindu terrorists' and i dont know what you talking. Regarding clubbing them, who is clubbing, i was merely citing examples, whose magnitudes vary by multiple proportions.I only meant to say "there are people who are like this here"(please refer to last paragraph of this comment) and "there are people who are like that there(Lashkar)" and in no way i have equated them.If you think i have loose tongue,then i think you have loose imagination.let me make it moe clear.Assuming(my assumption is linked to the question i asked in last paragraph below) that there is a segment within Hindus called X and then there is Lashkar or Al Qaeda.There is a difference.X targets only Islam,while Lashkar etc target whole world.There is a difference,which i very much see and i do not compare them at all.But what i was talking about is this act of 'Targetting' and you completely misconstrued it and felt offended (strange,that i still cut through the offense that you throw on me in many forms).

And please check my previous comment. I wrote, "See,i think things like these first need to be discussed with them and that also can be done or initiated only by educated people within their own community." Doesnt it mean that the burden is on them to change?Then why are you explaining all that to me,when i already made the point which you are saying.does it mean that you are hell bent on having a final say,despite the fact that i am agreeing to what you said and have infact stated the obvious which you are not saying.

And Kedar, i did not get your answer on the one question i have asked.Does(or Did) any segment within the Hindu community, like 'X',commit crime against any other religion?Does(did) any segment indulge in any such act of violence which causes harm to any innocent person of other religions?Can you give me a plain 'Yes' or 'No', without putting it in the brackets of cause,effect,retaliation,reaction, saving Hindu's honour,etc etc.A simple Yes or No.I told you before,that if it is No, i would be more proud.and if it is Yes,then i would not subscribe to that segment(and not complete Hinduism,uff!i think i need to overexplain everything to avoid the risk of being completely misunderstood,as it has always been so).So,please tell me a Yes or No. and it would do more good if you can clarify whether VHP/BJ come under Yes or No.

(I urge you to give precise answer in Yes or No, instead of again pulling me into the muck of Media feeds,Congress strategies blah blah..because i have understood one thing,despite me agreeing with you,you folks dont want this debate to end, and example is you repeating what i have already said, that the onus is on them to change.and ofcourse, misinterpretations and impulsive conclusions are a norm in these debates now)

Gandaragolaka said... @ Friday, December 05, 2008 9:50:00 PM

"And Kedar, i did not get your answer on the one question i have asked.Does(or Did) any segment within the Hindu community, like 'X',commit crime against any other religion?"

This is a trick question. Hence, I will give multiple answers:
1)No.
2)Yes.
3)Both.

No explanations offered as per your wishes.

Anonymous said... @ Friday, December 05, 2008 10:34:00 PM

"Anyways,whatever happened to that 'secular' God you were suggesting.i am still waiting for the name."

mmm, Iam still searching for the name myself because all the gods available have an affiliation to some religion and hence are discriminatory.

Lets see, Karunanidhi!

Aakarsh said... @ Friday, December 05, 2008 11:12:00 PM

Kedar,

Wonderful.Is it diplomacy?The answer pleased me a bit and also disappointed me a bit.So next time, if at all i write about something whose answer can be traced to this question,plz remember that there is also a 'Yes' and 'Both' in your answer, apart from No.But dont worry, i have never criticized a single segment,isolating it.I have always condemned violence backed by religion and that applies to violence ignited by segments in every religion.You can check all my previous posts, in which i never pointed a single religion.Now, dont drag this further again (experience!!!)

Anyways,shall we call it a day, for this debate, lest we again run into a loop of never ending misinterpretations.

Vidya, Plzzzzz...Karunandhi!!There are many reasons why i dislike him a lot and some of them are the very ones why you too dislike him.But dont confuse me. You ought to look for 'secular' God and not 'Athiestic' God (oxymoron, but then),who does not have any affiliation.A 'secular' God,i trust,can and will have affliation to some religion and i dont mind at all,because even i do.So, when you find one,do let me know.

Enough i guess. Shall i now say - The case rests.

Gandaragolaka said... @ Sunday, December 07, 2008 9:14:00 AM

There are still some loose ends that I would have love to see resolved, but then, there is always dandakaaranya for such things.

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